People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Discussion On All Aspects Of The Film.

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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby NefariousNed on Tue May 10, 2016 2:02 am

MUSTANG wrote:...An analysis of over a dozen script iterations showed how some of the various speeches were subtly modified; a word here, a sentence there.

"I can truly see why you are a great American legend."
"Don't take any wooden nickels."
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby RLC-GTT on Tue May 10, 2016 2:30 am

Hahahaha! Hated those lines.

I hear you, John, and I really don't disagree. The only thing I would add (and have before, I believe) is that these guys (these positions: director, writer, etc.) were pretty cut and dry in 1959. The Auteur Theory of Cinema -- where the director IS the movie and everybody else is simply a tool -- hadn't set in yet in the U.S. It was craft oriented, even at the directing level. I see the Wayne-Grant relationship as being somewhat more that way. Wayne gave Grant certain tasks and goals. Grant achieved them his way. Wayne accepted this. History was one of the goals, so once he assigned Grant the task, he didn't question it anymore. "Your the writer!" would have come out of his mouth numerous times during the production, even if he would say, "No, don't give me that. Give me something like this." He correctly trusted Grant to provide him with the dialog he needed to be John Wayne, and thus, once he got material he felt comfortable with, he didn't need to change it. It is a tremendous challenge to direct yourself, because you are too lenient. A director must be able to watch the actor and say, "No! That's too much! You already said that in the first line." Wayne did not have a director that did that -- except when Ford was on set.
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby NefariousNed on Tue May 10, 2016 2:37 am

RLC-GTT wrote: ...It is a tremendous challenge to direct yourself, because you are too lenient. A director must be able to watch the actor and say, "No! That's too much! You already said that in the first line." Wayne did not have a director that did that -- except when Ford was on set.

Man, good point! Excellent, Rich!
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby MUSTANG on Tue May 10, 2016 3:54 am

I do agree that while Wayne more than knew many of the technical aspects of the directorial profession, and quite possibly some of the cinematic ones as well, translating that knowledge into a creative, imaginative result was the real issue. There are numerous examples where he knew what he wanted but couldn't articulate it effectively to those responsible for execution. I agree. Wearing three hats simultaneously, he must have had difficulty stepping back and viewing the situation from a non-biased critical perspective.
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby RLC-GTT on Tue May 10, 2016 4:35 am

Indeed.
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby MUSTANG on Tue May 10, 2016 4:52 am

Here's an interesting little story. Although married three times to Latin women, supposedly Wayne didn't really know that much Spanish. In fact, he needed and utilized the services of an interpreter while filming "The Alamo." However... in Lou Sabini's book "Behind the Scenes of They Were Expendable: A Pictorial History,the author states and has photographs of Wayne translating John Ford's instructions to Philippine extras who were in the film.
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby SantaClaus on Tue May 10, 2016 4:57 am

MUSTANG wrote: I agree. Wearing three hats simultaneously, he must have had difficulty stepping back and viewing the situation from a non-biased critical perspective.

I believe in the 2016 hhd thread that there is a photo of Mo wearing 3 hats. It didnt occur to me at the time, but perhaps Mo was paying
tribute to John Wayne that day. ;)
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby SantaClaus on Tue May 10, 2016 5:03 am

MUSTANG wrote:Here's an interesting little story. Although married three times to Latin women, supposedly Wayne didn't really know that much Spanish. In fact, he needed and utilized the services of an interpreter while filming "The Alamo." However... in Lou Sabini's book "Behind the Scenes of They Were Expendable: A Pictorial History,the author states and has photographs of Wayne translating John Ford's instructions to Philippine extras who were in the film.

Maybe Wayne learned from that experience that it was better to have an interpreter who actually spoke clear and concise Spanish.
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby RLC-GTT on Tue May 10, 2016 3:51 pm

MUSTANG wrote:Here's an interesting little story. Although married three times to Latin women, supposedly Wayne didn't really know that much Spanish. In fact, he needed and utilized the services of an interpreter while filming "The Alamo." However... in Lou Sabini's book "Behind the Scenes of They Were Expendable: A Pictorial History,the author states and has photographs of Wayne translating John Ford's instructions to Philippine extras who were in the film.

Another Hollywood protocol is that the director only talks to the actors and his production team: Director of Photography, Production Designer, and 1st. Assistant Director. Then these key people pass the instructions down to their crew heads. It's not snobbery. It is keeping the director focused and keeping his communication world simple. Now, Duke Wayne certainly wasn't a fellow to keep from bellowing at an extra if he felt like it, but perhaps the correct structure was provided for by using the interpreter. The question therefor wouldn't be whether Wayne spoke Spanish, but whether his 2nd. Assistant Director did. This is the person who handles extras on a movie. The director tells the A.D., the A.D. tells the 2nd. A.D. and the 2nd. A.D. tells the extras. I'm sure that on THE ALAMO however the structure would have broken down quickly.
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby RLC-GTT on Tue May 10, 2016 3:55 pm

In fact, it was usually the 3rd. A.D. (or the Second 2nd. A.D. as he/she is now referred to) who handled the extras (or "Atmosphere" as they are now called).
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby SantaClaus on Wed May 11, 2016 2:00 pm

RLC-GTT wrote:In fact, it was usually the 3rd. A.D. (or the Second 2nd. A.D. as he/she is now referred to) who handled the extras (or "Atmosphere" as they are now called).

Extras are called "Atmosphere"? When did that start? I think there should be Academy Awards and Emmys for Best Extra or Best Atmosphere.
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Re: People Involved In The Production Of The Film.

Postby RLC-GTT on Thu May 12, 2016 6:47 am

Many years ago.
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