Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Fri Sep 12, 2014 5:52 pm

RLC-GTT wrote:Possible. Or it may be a "run-through," when they run the action of a scene without rolling camera. Crew members are just standing around talking. If it were a real "take," everybody -- EVERYBODY -- would be focused on the action. Plus, the stills photographer took this from the camera crane, and he would not be allowed up there during a take. It would just be the camera operator, the focus-puller (1st. assistant) and the director, if he chose to be. So, perhaps, during the rehearsal (for the extras, not the camera), the stills photographer might have been allowed to get a shot from the crane or allowed one of the crane crew to get it for him. All just a guess on my part, knowing the pace and attitude of a film in production and the rules.

And, as Craig Covner pointed out, there's that truck in the courtyard beside the chapel. Not a "yellow school bus", to be sure. It would be unseen in a ground level shot.
Click on link: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1223&p=83910&hilit=truck+covner#p83910
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Tue Feb 10, 2015 9:32 pm

I was just thinking... in the "Main Frontal Attack", why were there no ladder bearers? Was Santa Anna merely "counting their guns"?
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby whiterabbitt83 on Sun Apr 12, 2015 1:57 pm

there is a scene where Davy is sending Flacka away
the Parson arrives with a wagon with all Flackas clothes as
she gets to the Parson, the Parson says 'his name is jesus/hay-zuss
he is a good honest mule
here is my Question how can u tell a honest mule
from a dishonest mule lol, and is a dishonest mule
a outlaw,lol that line allways had me laughing :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby Fargo Fenwyck on Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:56 pm

Must have been a REPUBLICAN :roll: :lol: :mrgreen: :oops: :o :shock:
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby whiterabbitt83 on Sun Apr 12, 2015 10:14 pm

fargo
only honest mule i know is
Francis the talking mule
Image
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby RLC-GTT on Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:18 am

There is an old adage in Hollywood. "If his lips are moving, he's lying." :lol:
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:09 am

Chill Wills did the voice for Francis, the talking mule.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby Seguin on Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:20 am

I never knew there was such a thing as honest and
dishonest mules, but now I do, thanks to John Wayne.
I wonder in which way a dishonest mule is dishonest?
Does it cheat when playing cards or what? :D
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby whiterabbitt83 on Mon Apr 13, 2015 5:34 pm

where did John Wayne learn so much about mules?
honest and dishonest, i know from reading mustangs book
he called a few people a jackass, :lol: :lol:
i know he is a animal lover, with all his jackass and mule comments :P :P
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Re: Actual Scenes From The Alamo { 1960 } Film

Postby Travis247 on Sat May 02, 2015 7:58 pm

Reb_Al wrote:Image


Rich,

Remember I asked that question about any paint around the doorways, well in this phot and a few of the others of the South wall gate house that tan or faded red stripe is up down the doorways. What say ye?

Frank
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby Rick on Fri Jul 24, 2015 5:24 pm

Here are two more photos courtesy of Bill (Doc) O'Hara. He can tell us about them:

Image


Image
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby Doc on Fri Jul 24, 2015 6:10 pm

Thanks again for the aid and assistance, Rick.
Found these abroad. The first one shows that Wayne was on the mound at least during one take but unless Patrick Wayne has already run off of it, I can't place him.
The whole scene looks odd to me, but I can't quite name why. Thought you experts might be able to help.

Although the second one is simply a progression of the scene in other postings, it shows the various Mexican units starting to merge together.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby Dakota Jeff on Fri Jul 24, 2015 8:09 pm

I don't think Wayne was on this hill during this take. Must have been after he and Patrick left.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby mrbassbone on Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:58 am

Dakota Jeff wrote:I don't think Wayne was on this hill during this take. Must have been after he and Patrick left.

That IS Duke behind the cannon to its right.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby alamocentral on Sun Aug 02, 2015 2:58 pm

Crockett is on the flag mound from before the scene starts until after it finishes. He is there when the cannon fires; when Patrick runs down the mound; and after the scene finishes. This is clear as a bell on theatrical prints, and on the
16 stills I have in front of me (of the sequence). He stays up there for filming the unhorsing of Jim Burk and Jack Williams, as well. I can only guess that the confusion arose from people who saw a non-letterboxed video.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby RLC-GTT on Sun Aug 02, 2015 3:53 pm

alamocentral wrote:I can only guess that the confusion arose from people who saw a non-letterboxed video.
AlamoCentral

And thus only saw half of the movie -- and missed a lot! ;)
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby alamocentral on Sun Aug 02, 2015 6:53 pm

For those of you who own the laser disc, look at the photo on the back of the box set. It shows the cannon firing at the NW corner of the compound. Crockett is clearly present in the shot. Of special interest, is that the flag pole has
been "painted" out. Wayne appears twice in the Reynold Brown painting. One is him swinging the torch. The other shows him in silhouette firing the canon on the flag mound. Even the so called letterboxed versions of the home video
do not show the entire frame of the film. Everybody I have shown my theatrical prints to, has exclaimed that they "had no idea the picture was so wide". There is even more detail in the 70mm prints.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby SantaClaus on Tue Oct 20, 2015 5:42 am

NefariousNed wrote:Image
Did you ever notice the look of disdain that Crockett gives Bowie right after Bowie says,
"Travis says! I wouldn't take Travis' word that night was dark and day was light!" It's
almost as though Bowie has gone down a peg respect-wise in Crockett's eyes. How do you
read it?


I watched "The Alamo" on DVD again today. I've been perusing back pages on the forum, and came across the above question. Coincidentally, I got a new impression when I saw Crockett give that look. My thought was that Bowie's statement had jarred Crockett for the first time to actually consider that Fannin wasn't coming and that Travis's promise was either wishful thinking or an outright lie. It's a moment of doubt.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby RLC-GTT on Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:16 pm

It would probably be more in line with the film's concept to see Crockett as thinking, "Boy, I've got to solve THIS problem."

Or possibly, "Boy, Kristi sure is right about Widmark!" :lol:
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby TexianAtHeartII on Wed Oct 21, 2015 3:24 am

Always been puzzled by that whole scene. Bowie reciting that phrase to Crockett and then to Travis himself and the reaction by both Travis and Dickinson. Like Bowie insulted Travis family origins. And Travis telling him he could never forgive him for that. Really, Will? With all the disdain you've had towards Bowie, the jealousy, the rubbing his face into you being named commandant over him. After all, Bowie is a nothing compared to you, an educated lawyer from a fine family. You should be the one with all the acreage, not a backwoods buffoon raised in a swamp.
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Re: Actual Scenes From The Alamo { 1960 } Film

Postby Travis247 on Sat Oct 24, 2015 8:46 pm

Reb_Al wrote:Image

This screen shot of Travis having a "nip" after chastizing Sequin:

Cantina-night before:

Crockett- "lets wet our whistles, words are dusty".

Travis: " I dont drink.
Crockett: "not ever"?
Travis: "no".
Crockett:" Well I've heard of such".

Travis: "unless I'm in my quarters drinking puli fuse". ( Cochises words, not mine sir) Uhhh wrong movie.

Script did not spare these scenes either.

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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Sat Oct 24, 2015 9:08 pm

Harvey was a Brit, and Brits do not consider port as drink. So Harvey was not lying. The real Travis was supposed to have drank little and gambled a lot.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby AlamoMo on Sun Oct 25, 2015 1:36 pm

Personally Ned I like a glass of port with some cheese and biscuits :) :P

It simply tastes like strong cordial

Regards

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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby MartyB on Thu Jan 07, 2016 2:42 pm

AFTERMATH...
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby MartyB on Sun Jan 10, 2016 3:46 pm

THE ALAMO…

Fighting near the jacales…
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Tue Jan 12, 2016 1:26 pm

Nice examples of jacales. Someone did their homework.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby RLC-GTT on Tue Jan 12, 2016 3:55 pm

Alfred Ybarra.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby MUSTANG on Tue Jan 12, 2016 8:41 pm

Indeed.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby SantaClaus on Tue Jan 12, 2016 8:51 pm

NefariousNed wrote:Nice examples of jacales. Someone did their homework.

I see them, and have seen the word, but what are jacales? Houses? Sheds?
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby cc nolen on Tue Jan 12, 2016 11:32 pm

Ja' kalez....same as Hyenas!! :o - Naaah. :lol:
These were the small homes and structures built by the Mexican Rural Population. Most had thatched grass roofs and could be burned with ease. :D
The Texans didn't want the soldados to use these as objects to hide behind, so they burned a lot of them. ;)
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby RLC-GTT on Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:46 am

Right on, Chris. In addition to the straw roofs (tule actually -- a reed that grew in the San Antonio River and San Pedro Creek), these lower class homes were constructed of verticle posts (cedar or mesquit) stuck in the ground and chinked with mud. Sometimes a lime plaster coating was applied on the outside. Actually, these could be built out of any materials available -- boards, posts, sticks, parts of barrels. Anything that would keep out the elements. Plaza de Valero south from the Alamo was lined with them and these, as Chris says, were burned by the Texians during the siege -- not just a movie gimmick.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby AlamoAaron on Sat Jan 16, 2016 4:24 am

The long barracks fight in Wayne's Alamo was...quite pathetic. Much better in 2004 Alamo.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Sat Jan 16, 2016 6:16 am

AlamoAaron wrote:The long barracks fight in Wayne's Alamo was...quite pathetic. Much better in 2004 Alamo.

I don't recall a Long Barrack fight in Wayne's Alamo at all. There was one cut scene where a Tennessean is on the stairs to Travis' headquarters and then gets shot down. Then there are defenders on the roof that get blown down by artillery. In the 2004 film, while the fighting in the barrack looks intense, it goes by in about four seconds. The soldados didn't even have to blast down the doors, they were just never shut. And fighting up from that trench in the center of the room seemed rather like folly. Soldiers were usually told to take the high ground to gain advantage. The ditch was supposed to be a fallback position to hide in in case artillery was used to blast the doors. Again, this never happened in the film. That being said, some reenactors and extras on the old thealmofilmsite commented how most of the Long Barrack fight went onto the cutting room floor.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby SantaClaus on Sat Jan 16, 2016 5:59 pm

NefariousNed wrote:
AlamoAaron wrote:The long barracks fight in Wayne's Alamo was...quite pathetic. Much better in 2004 Alamo.

I don't recall a Long Barrack fight in Wayne's Alamo at all. There was one cut scene where a Tennessean is on the stairs to Travis' headquarters and then gets shot down. Then there are defenders on the roof that get blown down by artillery. In the 2004 film, while the fighting in the barrack looks intense, it goes by in about four seconds. The soldados didn't even have to blast down the doors, they were just never shut. And fighting up from that trench in the center of the room seemed rather like folly. Soldiers were usually told to take the high ground to gain advantage. The ditch was supposed to be a fallback position to hide in in case artillery was used to blast the doors. Again, this never happened in the film. That being said, some reenactors and extras on the old thealmofilmsite commented how most of the Long Barrack fight went onto the cutting room floor.

Don't forget, in John Wayne's The Alamo, there were a couple of Texans shooting out the door or window until a incendiary grenade was tossed in, driving them out screaming and smoking to be quickly shot down. Wait! Was that the long barrack or somewhere on the west wall? In that same scene, after the two Texans are shot, it always looks to me like one Mexican soldier is trying to reload his rifle as if it's a breach loader. Did that look strange to anybody else? Well, what the heck. If one guy had a hand grenade, I guess another guy can load from the wrong end of his gun.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Sat Jan 16, 2016 6:58 pm

SantaClaus wrote:Don't forget, in John Wayne's The Alamo, there were a couple of Texans shooting out the door or window until a incendiary
grenade was tossed in, driving them out screaming and smoking to be quickly shot down. Wait! Was that the long barrack or
somewhere on the west wall?

Yes, west wall. That block of buildings is the only original part of the west wall yet standing.
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SantaClaus wrote:In that same scene, after the two Texans are shot, it always looks to me like one Mexican soldier is trying to reload his rifle
as if it's a breach loader. Did that look strange to anybody else? Well, what the heck. If one guy had a hand grenade, I guess
another guy can load from the wrong end of his gun.
Richard McClory

Yes, most of the extras were using modified Springfield trapdoor rifles with false frizzens to make the guns look like muskets.
That scene does look awkward with the one soldado pausing to obviously reload his gun from beneath by breechblock.
Yes, the "grenade" could've been an incendiary one. The Mexican army did have a grenadier company, though the use of
grenades had gone out of fashion by that time and the title was just that. Grenades are effective. Why ever stop using them?
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby AlamoAaron on Sat Jan 16, 2016 8:26 pm

SantaClaus wrote:
NefariousNed wrote:
AlamoAaron wrote:The long barracks fight in Wayne's Alamo was...quite pathetic. Much better in 2004 Alamo.

I don't recall a Long Barrack fight in Wayne's Alamo at all. There was one cut scene where a Tennessean is on the stairs to Travis' headquarters and then gets shot down. Then there are defenders on the roof that get blown down by artillery. In the 2004 film, while the fighting in the barrack looks intense, it goes by in about four seconds. The soldados didn't even have to blast down the doors, they were just never shut. And fighting up from that trench in the center of the room seemed rather like folly. Soldiers were usually told to take the high ground to gain advantage. The ditch was supposed to be a fallback position to hide in in case artillery was used to blast the doors. Again, this never happened in the film. That being said, some reenactors and extras on the old thealmofilmsite commented how most of the Long Barrack fight went onto the cutting room floor.

Don't forget, in John Wayne's The Alamo, there were a couple of Texans shooting out the door or window until a incendiary grenade was tossed in, driving them out screaming and smoking to be quickly shot down. Wait! Was that the long barrack or somewhere on the west wall? In that same scene, after the two Texans are shot, it always looks to me like one Mexican soldier is trying to reload his rifle as if it's a breach loader. Did that look strange to anybody else? Well, what the heck. If one guy had a hand grenade, I guess another guy can load from the wrong end of his gun.
Richard McC


Yeah, I was referring to the grenade bombing.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Sat Jan 16, 2016 10:23 pm

Image
This photo was taken from the Alamo-north end Long Barrack stairs looking over toward the west wall where the grenadier tossed his
grenade into that second door from the north, I believe. Or was it the third door, just left of that beehive stove. Rich? The ruins of
Laurence Harvey's battle position can be seen on the far right in the photo
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby SantaClaus on Sat Jan 16, 2016 10:55 pm

I took a ton of pictures of the Wayneamo and the Alamo in San Antonio around 1970 or so, and I remember going into the West wall buildings and even onto the roof. I had them all developed as slides, and have know idea how I could post them. I doubt that I could find the negatives. It's been a long time since I looked at them. I think I'll set up a little slide show for myself and see if I can at least put them into order.
Anybody know how slides can be turned into electronic images for a computer?
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby NefariousNed on Sat Jan 16, 2016 11:29 pm

SantaClaus wrote:Anybody know how slides can be turned into electronic images for a computer?
Richard McClory

Take them to your local photo lab (Drug Store, Walmart, Costco, Sam's Club) and they can put them onto a photo disc for you. I've done it.
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Re: Actual Scenes From THE ALAMO (1960) Film

Postby alamojim on Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:39 pm

Mustang, re: Joan's comment from several postings back about the Waynemo's ending being ranked in the top 50 movie endings, I was at the cast reunion when she made that comment during the symposium, but as far as I can remember, she either didn't mention where she had heard (or read that) or if she did I just don't recall the source. I tend to think, though, that she said she wasn't sure where she had read it.
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